I recently received a clean recording of 1970, it was very good. I was still in Vanguard in 70 and comparing this recording with corps of the same year, I find no technical reason NP didn't do better than they did. NP should of been 1 of Ill's top 3 again I recall times you should of beat Vanguard and Cavies. NP did get more than there fair share of extra talent from the disbanded RA. Granted certian corps had a few misinformed judges that didn't see things fairly, but NP seemed to have a lot more of them. The recording I have came from Estabula(sp)where NP did beat SC Vanguard, now I believe the usual suspects (judges) weren't there and you finely got what you deserved. Although it's water under the bridge, does anyone want to comment on who you ****** off, or were you just misunderstood? (On a personal note I do both.)

What years were you a Corps member? 73-74

Gregg raised an interesting point by asking about the 1970 Imperials. The corps was pretty good that year overall, but very inconsistent. Could do very well one week, badly the next.

At the Deerfield show in July, they beat the SC Vanguard.... as I said in an earlier post....

As for the "Santa Clara thing" in 1970 - remember that those were different days, including the judging. This was pre-DCI, and although there were still bad judges and "judges with friends, or pre-set agendas", it wasn't as bad as it is now. A corps having a good night could still beat a corps which had a bad night.

I think that is what happened with Santa Clara that night. Norwood was pretty good that year, but normally would have been beaten by the Vanguard. BUT .. that day the Imperials did a good show (very relaxed, they really had nothing to lose). The Vanguard was really "off" and looked tired after their travels.

And, the judging went Norwood's way.

The next night, a number of the "well known" and "well connected" judges said that they'd show that the Deerfield result was wrong! After all, the Imperials COULDN'T defeat the SC Vanguard! And, the 10 point score difference emerged.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

I have always felt that the 1970 corps was under-rated, and that minus the bus crash could have made a run at national prominence again in the 70's.

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

WOW, been looking for that recording for years. Would be a good one for this site,hint hint. Also, as far as beating SCV one night and getting spanked the next, we have only one person to thank. So, without further adue, THANK YOU, Don Angelica

Considering that Santa Clara had already beaten the Cavaliers and Troopers, for that one night in Deerfield, Norwood was at the top of the heap!

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

Greg, is the recording from Paul Tamasek, I know he had a reel to reel from that show that was that was really good. Ashtabula, Ohio was our last show before we decided to try a new hobby.(cliff diving) That, as you know didn't work out very well. On another subject, was told by management that we were asked to be in the combine, after that year but declined. Don't know if that's true or not, But thought Bob would be the only one who might talk to Don Warren to see if there's any truth to that.

Larry,

I never heard that one before, but I'll certainly look into it. Everytime the 1970 season comes up, it seems like such a pivotal point in Norwood's history that just went the wrong way!

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

I agree that 1970 was a pivotal year for the Imperials. The corps was good and on the 'brink' of becoming VERY good.

I have never heard of the corps being asked to join the 'Combine'. That would have been very difficult due to finances, corps size, travel requirements, etc. It would have been a MAJOR change for the corps .. as it was for most corps. This accelerated the transition from 'community' drum corps to 'professional'.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

Two 1970 scores of note...

Aug 16 Ashtabula, OH

Corps Score
1 Anaheim Kingsmen 79.950
2 DeLaSalle Oaklands 75.150
3 Appleknockers 67.550
4 Shoreliners 67.300
5 Skokie Imperials 66.100

July 4 Deerfield, IL

Skokie Imperials 71.75
Santa Clara Vanguard 69.6 - 3 pt. penalty
Racine Scouts 68.1
St. Pat's Imperials no score avail
Mariners 53
---------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

I talked to a few Cavalier people who should know, and they don't recall anything about Norwood being invited into the Combine. Des Plaines Vanguard and Kilties weren't even asked, due to organizational problems and suspected overage members, so I would be surprised if Norwood was considered. But it's an interesting rumor, and one that I never heard before.

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

I have a good 70, a ok 73 at Springfield track, and a tape in the stands of 72 DCI prelims. any idea how to down load them on the NP site?

What years were you a Corps member? 73-74

Sorry Greg don't know nothing about down loads. On the combine, the truth must not have been spoken. I agree with Dave about the hardship's of being in it after the fact, however I think it would have shown guts,that there was a plan and vision.

Larry if you want a copy of that, E-mail me off line. Your not on the Email list.

What years were you a Corps member? 73-74

I just noticed this post and thought I'd give what I remember from my house. With my dad and brother Tom discussing it, it was a sore subject. My dad saw it as a breakup in drum corp. He was a union guy and saw it as DCI being management and the rest of the corps being employees. He only wanted it to be for the kids and not be a business. I don't see how we could have joined unless we had merged with some other corp. We didn't have the size, the money or the connections that a corp like the Cavies had.

Steve,

I think you and I had the same Dad!

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

Regarding joining DCI, Steve Kas pointed out: "He (his dad) only wanted it to be for the kids and not be a business. I don't see how we could have joined unless we had merged with some other corp. We didn't have the size, the money or the connections that a corp like the Cavies had.
--------------------------------

1. I am sure that the current DCI leaders say they are doing it "for the kids". But, "the kids" are way different now. No longer local, community kids (often needing positive activities), they are, at least at the World Class level, college music students. Even the Open Class members have to be well off to spend much of their summers touring.

2. Size, money and connections ... those are the really important things now. The Imperials never had those things.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

And that was Dad's initial projection (which certainly came true): that DCI would eventually kill the small corps. I think it took longer than he originally thought, but it did happen.

One thing I miss is the occasional "surprise" corps that would jump into finals for a year or two, giving some freshness to the mix. When is the last time a truly "new" corps made finals? And forget the top 6 - there hasn't been a change there in decades! The top 3 has basically been stagnant that long as well. I think the early 90's was the last time anything was even close to unpredictable in a season. But this was bound to happen as the number of corps dropped. it improved the quality of the remaining corps (more talent for less organizations = better performances for everyone), but each year has become just a "rearranging" of the year before.

I miss the days when an almost unheard of corps would make finals - Bleu Raeders, Purple Lancers, Commodores, Black Knights, Royal Crusaders, etc.

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

Boy do I remember that night in Deerfield. It felt so wonderful to beat one of the BIG guys!

What did you do in the Corps? Color Guard & Soprano

What years were you a Corps member? 1970 - 1973

Donna .. it WAS great! I was on staff then as assistant drum instructor, and it was really great to have the Imperials do so well. Gosh, the corps members were really working hard to improve.

At that time, the SC Vanguard was an 'up and coming' corps, but not yet at THE top. At the same time, the Imperials were building and hoping for more growth. In my opinion, the Deerfield show caught the Vanguard at a 'low spot', while the Imperials were "up'.

In those days, judges actually rewarded corps for their performance, rather than reputation, connections and affiliation. (OF course, this is just an opinion).

---------------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

I read somewhere that they had changed the judging system for this year's DCI shows, but I don't know what they did. If you look at the current scores, they seem low compared to the last many years - more like where the season used to start (60's and low 70's). I'll have a report on Sunday about the show here in Orlando tomorrow - assuming it isn't rained out!

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

Hope it doesn't rain on you! Could you please send some of the rain to Chicagoland!

What did you do in the Corps? Color Guard & Soprano

What years were you a Corps member? 1970 - 1973

Hey Greg, Would it be possible to get a copy of that 1970 recording? Will you be up here for this year's picnic, I could get if from you then.

What did you do in the Corps? Color Guard & Soprano

What years were you a Corps member? 1970 - 1973

Bob, I am not sure of the scoring, but some of the early DCI shows are using reduced judging panels (fewer judges, not smaller judges). :)

Take a look at the recaps to see how they allocate points when this happens.
-----------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63

The only problem with reading modern recap sheets is that I don't even know what the captions are talking about! I can't find the word "drums" anywhere!

What did you do in the Corps? Snare; Drum Major; Drum Instructor/Arranger

What years were you a Corps member? 1970-73; 78-79

Ha! Bab said: The only problem with reading modern recap sheets is that I don't even know what the captions are talking about! I can't find the word "drums" anywhere!
----------------------------

That's because this isn't drum and bugle corps anymore! :)
'marching' is 'visual', brass and drums are 'music' and 'evaluation' and 'analysis' are used instead of 'performance'. Going to a critique must be a real blast now.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

What did you do in the Corps? drummer; quartermaster 1964-66; asst. drum instr. 1964-70

What years were you a Corps member? 1958-63